A Discussion With Paul VanderKlay (YouTube)

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Dr. Menzies says most Westerners are fundamentalists without recognizing it. They have an unquestioned belief in democracy, free markets and sexual liberty. He's written a book on this subject which we discuss. He is an economist with a degree from Oxford University and lives and works in Sydney Australia.

Western Fundamentalism https://amzn.to/2X0a3K8

Gordon Menzies

Father studied bomb shelters epidemiologist

Central Bank

Sydney, University of Technology

Oxford PhD

Donald hay, Christian economist

Oxford Union


Free Market Liberalism

Sexual Freedom

Three things uncritically

Western Fundamental

The conflict is because of vested interests. Bulverisms

Different pre-suppositions. Not necessarily because of the bulverisms.

Rather than look at the surface of arguments

The Fundamentals, a testimony to the truth

Propositional faith

What foundations do you use. James Orr’s pamphlet on Genesis

Stating a set of unprovable presuppositions and building something on top of it.

Calling someone a fundamentalist is anti-religious prejudice.

The fallacy of the special problem. Choosing to pin it onto religious people when it’s really a general problem.

A yearning for freedom.

Everybody builds their lives on unprovable things.

Transfering the metaphor of economic freedom from relationships.

Economic freedom and sexual freedom. An aesthetic right marginalize everyone else.

Democracy is good at letting a small group of people oppressing a large group of people.

Groups make better decisions than individuals.

Large number of buyers and sellers

Markets have nice properties about dealing with shortages and gluts

Leave the prices to move around and respond to shortages and gluts.

Mindset that everything is a mutually advantageous trade.

This cost-benefit mindset, ruthless regard for your advantage,

Regard people’s preferences as a fixed thing

It’s the market’s job to meet those preferences

Joint goods

Knock-on effects. Petrol contributes to pollution, well understood, an externality

Effects of markets onsocial situations, motivation crowding out.

Commercial mindset walks into a situation it transforms it.

Moral frame. Once a price was involved it was a babysitting tax.

Commodification, not just knock-on effects, The people themselves are shrunk and de-personalized.

Outcomes is a transferal of a market mentality into a sexual ethic. Wanting to use markets in every area society.

Gary Becker, Nobel Prize winning, how the economy effects people’s ideas of marriage

Stephanie Coontz, 1950s particular high point in the status of marriage in the world.

People were prepared to count their blessings.

Human kind of sinful. Don’t like looking back to a golden age.

Whether we’ve got too far away from that.

Most people don’t plan on an accident, but they do plan on traffic jams.

Relationships instability has moved from the accident category to the traffic jam category.

Relationships to be stable enough. Rely on the relationship continuing.

Relational environment so unstable.

Does democracy care about the weak

People have fundamentally equal value.

Fixing up pollution in the world, breed everyone to be half the size and nobody eats meat.

Who agrees with this being a compulsory policy.

Why are people more valuable than animals

A religious answer, special dignity

It’s an illusion. We’re not an evolutionary bias

We are more valuable because of our greater capacities.

Are people equal

Democracy holds onto that.

John Stuart Mill: whatever you like up to the limit of harm. Very weak criteria

Nietzsche: The strong, the powerful, the beautiful, will restore greco-roman greatness to the West. Also the hard working.

LImiting markets to a sphere

What will stand in the way of the market?

People only recognize evil on the fringe, like a centrifuge. They don’t recognize it in the small, mundane amounts. People used evil much more freely after 9/11.

The danger of using WW2 is that we only recognize it in extreme forms and not in ourselves.

Christians who are feeling marginalized in the secular world

People who feel marginalized that their culture is looked down on.

They are bad at looking at their own presuppositions.

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